discussion NTR is not a dream, its a nightmare. Just say NO to NTR!

[cosicosi89]

I'd say generally harem doesnt necessarily require ntr, but I mean if one is being realistic it may be a plot point that becomes inevitable. I am glad most harem games dont care to add that cuz jealousy makes me sad

U got a point there

It is protagonist perspective. Netori the protagonist steal someone girl. The protagonist is highlighted as the one stealing girl. Netorare the protagonist is highlighted as the one girl being stolen. Netorase no stealing just protagonist sharing his girl.

What if the girl is stolen back? Does that cancel ntr

I've been dealing with a lot of NeeTR shrieking lately due to my games, and I've cultivated a theory about it:

By the very function of a visual novel being a story with porn, most are going to be about the main character getting laid. That's why 99.9% of all visual novels play into the male fantasy of being the guy every girl wants because he's got a shitty personality and a big dick.




It's Chad roleplay. Women can't resist the main character, even if it's their sister or mother. You don't get rejected, and if they do try to reject you, it's rape o'clock because you're the MC, and that's a whole other power fantasy.

But Porn is a fantasy, right? What does this have to do with NTR?

NTR has evolved from the technical definition to a borderline InCel catch-all for any content that violates this Alpha Chad fantasy. The same guys who say, "Don't they get it? It's just pixels?" will also start REEEE-ing at those pixels when they don't directly play into that fantasy. If a woman is in the game, then they are there for MC to bang, as if their dick was Chekov's Gun. Conversely, any woman existing to do something other than to be the MC's cock receptacle is NTR. Period.

When Burned V.1 came out, people complained that Mia and Kristy / Mia and Sasha fooling around was NTR. Never mind the fact that the MC had yet to really hook up with any of them, or they weren't in any form of relationship. I've seen NeeTRs get uncomfortable with the simple existence of a secondary male character because they're afraid he *might* bang one of their girls in a later update.

With Burned V.3, I recently discovered it doesn't matter if it's Girl-on-Girl; the emotional violation is still there. The girls are going against your fantasy and tainting your property. Therefore, it's NTR. You can't even joke about it. They won't find it funny. Instead, NeeTRS had a very visceral reaction because two girls were screwing around, and the main dick wasn't in the room.

And it is an emotional violation more than anything. In Malignant, soooo many NeeTRS flipped out when the wife admitted to cheating on the MC. Never mind that you don't actually see this cheating or that the MC has been emotionally and physically unfaithful to her for a friggin' decade. And you know what's funny? The scene where the MC is cucked by his doppelganger who literally impales his daughter on his dick--The scene I specifically put to foster an interesting discussion about NTR that'd take a weird turn into the theory of the mind because whether or not it counted as NTR depended entirely on the mystery of that moment-- That scene? They don't bring it because their fantasy isn't being violated by one of the female characters.

Honestly, it's insane and creatively stifling as a storyteller.

I agree . The creator should be free to create not be restricted by anyone

Going off topic here a little ... but not really cause it's ntr in a way just in real life.
+ i found it interesting so i guess/hope others may as well.

What he is saying is not a theory actually. It's is actually scientifically researched and proved already.
There have been numerous studies done on this already in many different countries by different institutions and government departments and is still ongoing.
Some starting back in the early '70's till now just to compare and compile data on human and animals behavioral patterns (other animals like apes, monkeys, rats and even birds) to see the differences and overlapping data.
It all started real innocent and just as scientific study. If you look at the numbers of those results so far and the worsening and declining heading of those numbers (end results/consequences) they are staggering and frightful.
What you are describing in the world of people going off with other peoples partners, sharing and swinging is actually what is wrong with the world today.
The overall rise in promiscuity in general before and during relationships/marriage is having lasting and negative results in society.
The ability for a woman to stay (pair bond / be and stay happy with 1 partner) in a long term lasting relationship is one of the main reasons there are so many single parent households with kids that grow up and go out into the world as adults
The result of that and those new adults are frightening as well as they fuck up way more then 2 parent households with way more severe and higher numbers in the more severe crimes range.

These are from 2010 when these results came out of the research. They normally do them every 10 years ,,,, but they,,, it's been a bit crazy all around the world when 2020 started till now.
The ability for woman to stay / pair bond purely from a scientific perspective are as followed.
The number of partners before a steady relationship with the objective of having children, marriage and a lasting relationship drops by 22% increase alone for woman after 1 sexual partner.
0 partners (you are the first) = 5% of a failing relationship, 1 =/adds 22% on top of the 5% , 2 partners adds another 12 %, 3 = 11% added on top of that , 4 - 5 is 18 %, 6 - 9 = 14%, 10+ = 18% ending up in a chance that hell will freeze over and pigs can fly that you are staying with that woman who had that many sexual partners before you.
There is way to much data with explanations as to what was compiled, variables, circumstances, religion and what not to type here. Source data and results from various institutions, government organizations like the american census and cdc These are the statistics for the usa.
These statistics change slightly from county to country depending on the populations number of men and woman, base religion of the country and so on. but they all show the same general results and decline. (excluding countries where no numbers are know or with religions that make certain things impossible for woman or men or data to be collected)

However, those numbers are still on the rise since that time. Divorce rates have steadily been going up the last decade and years 70 - 80% of the divorces are now filed by woman documented in the american census and cdc varying between those numbers from state to state
Of first marriages these days, 43% end up in a dissolved/divorce.

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Second and third marriages for those people actually fail at a far higher rate, with 60% of second marriages and 73% of third marriages ending in divorce.

With men the study show the decline but with a much more gradual way with the low numbers at the start and with far higher numbers of partners and excesses in jumps at the end of the high partner count, So the opposite and reverse direction as to woman.

The latest biological studies that have been done confirm/prove that dna will and can be found in that a woman's body of previous sexual partner(s) (unprotected sex).. Meaning lasting dna of a previous sexual partners is stored in her body. That combined with the rise of that promiscuity the willingness to have direct unprotected sex with options like the morning after pilla IUD The rise in std's that are going around as a result is no surprise.
Adding the disadvantage men have in the court system when getting divorced it is no wonder the willingness of men wanting to get married overall are down significantly.

So in conclusion ladies and gentlemen Pick carefully who and how/relation definition you want to spend your life with. I can have grave and lasting consequences.

Real life sucks ... that's why we are here .. seeking a bit of fantasy and escapism.


Everyone has opinions but let the artist create.

There might be the opposite side of that, 72 virgin men for girls or whatever. Actually where do they take all those virgins lol



I prefer lesbian NTR, gf cheating on you with her related sister or it's you the one who's cheating on her with your own sister. There is only one artist I know who's making such type of cute and adorable NTR manga it's "Takei Ooki".

Yes! It's so sexy. We need more story arcs like that

The solution to enjoying NTR is easy. Don't insert yourself as the guy/gal getting cucked in your imagination. Instead imagine that you are either the one fucking or simply watching from the outside. To me it is just extra spicy rape/corruption.

If u play lewd games .. u are a voyeur anyway

Porn games to me is exactly as it says, porn in form of a game. I don´t get possessive about the actors in the porn I watch and I don´t get possessive about som pixels getting getting fucked by some pixels, which is not the imaginary me. NTR is great sometimes and useless at other points. It´s all about how kinky it is.

Yep .. its the story and visual that matters

I feel people who have a strong visceral hatred of it may have a problem not separating fantasy and reality. Yet somehow, they are blissfully ignorant that they are not the only one who owns the characters of the games they're playing. Thousands of other people are playing the same game, with the same characters. Unless they are the ones who created the game, and have not shared the game, "their girls" are with other people, right now.

Fact is though that NTR is one of the most popular genres of adult games.

It's all fantasy anyway

 

[Uthuriel]

Still going I see... :kek:

 

[feralchild]

I like no-NTR as a whole.
Avoidable NTR means the creator spent time making scenes with NTR which is a waste of time for me.
If a game has avoidable NTR, I'll probably just not bother with it until the game is finished.

 

[A.K.A78]

I've been dealing with a lot of NeeTR shrieking lately due to my games, and I've cultivated a theory about it:

By the very function of a visual novel being a story with porn, most are going to be about the main character getting laid. That's why 99.9% of all visual novels play into the male fantasy of being the guy every girl wants because he's got a shitty personality and a big dick.

It's Chad roleplay. Women can't resist the main character, even if it's their sister or mother. You don't get rejected, and if they do try to reject you, it's rape o'clock because you're the MC, and that's a whole other power fantasy.

But Porn is a fantasy, right? What does this have to do with NTR?

NTR has evolved from the technical definition to a borderline InCel catch-all for any content that violates this Alpha Chad fantasy. The same guys who say, "Don't they get it? It's just pixels?" will also start REEEE-ing at those pixels when they don't directly play into that fantasy. If a woman is in the game, then they are there for MC to bang, as if their dick was Chekov's Gun. Conversely, any woman existing to do something other than to be the MC's cock receptacle is NTR. Period.

When Burned V.1 came out, people complained that Mia and Kristy / Mia and Sasha fooling around was NTR. Never mind the fact that the MC had yet to really hook up with any of them, or they weren't in any form of relationship. I've seen NeeTRs get uncomfortable with the simple existence of a secondary male character because they're afraid he *might* bang one of their girls in a later update.

With Burned V.3, I recently discovered it doesn't matter if it's Girl-on-Girl; the emotional violation is still there. The girls are going against your fantasy and tainting your property. Therefore, it's NTR. You can't even joke about it. They won't find it funny. Instead, NeeTRS had a very visceral reaction because two girls were screwing around, and the main dick wasn't in the room.

And it is an emotional violation more than anything. In Malignant, soooo many NeeTRS flipped out when the wife admitted to cheating on the MC. Never mind that you don't actually see this cheating or that the MC has been emotionally and physically unfaithful to her for a friggin' decade. And you know what's funny? The scene where the MC is cucked by his doppelganger who literally impales his daughter on his dick--The scene I specifically put to foster an interesting discussion about NTR that'd take a weird turn into the theory of the mind because whether or not it counted as NTR depended entirely on the mystery of that moment-- That scene? They don't bring it because their fantasy isn't being violated by one of the female characters.

Honestly, it's insane and creatively stifling as a storyteller.

I know what you mean and i get that you feel held back by people their opinion's about what is Ntr and what is not and what you want to write but are starting to be afraid of because of the backlash.
Seeing how many devs made the choice that making a vn is more then a hobby and either a Job, a way to make extra money or even as a cash cow, that is where things get tricky.
If a lot of people like what you make,, Great but you will have complainers none the less,,,, if a lot of people dislike it,,,, it happens. Maybe there are not that many who like it in the first place and you write for a small market/niche.
And yes maybe you made the story go in a direction people that did like it now as a result don't. Like adding a form of ntr that is disliked. You will never be able to please everyone.
The major sin is adding something that was not there at all from the start,, or in the planned/future tags. Just don't add ntr without a heads up cause that will make a lot of people pissed off

Now my opinion on that is no matter what a dev decides where a story goes i respect if he sticks with it and not cave to the wants and needs of the complainers. It is YOUR story that is all that should matter to you.
If people quite playing it, then they quite playing,, backing out after the fact will not get the people back + they will start complaining about something else they don't or do want cause they know there is a chance they can get it.

Depending on your expectations, hours spent making it, costs of making it and your end goal. Making a profit or just because you want to or even need to. Then you yourself must determine if it is worth it,,,
hence the abandoned tag on a lot of new devs their games i think.. costs, time and profit did not match. + you need to be able to finish a story as well and not write yourself in the proverbial corner.

Now about your, but porn is fantasy.
Yes and no. Yes it is fantasy but the player must/likes it to be immersive. If i can't imagine it being remotely me and the story is all about other people. Id rather watch a actual normal non porn movie for the story.
Also you can't claim something and say,, well it's fantasy so it's alright. No. If you make the Male MC fuck a dude and say he or that is not gay cause it's fantasy. It does not work like that. You can't give a (forced or not) love interest
in the story big tits and a dick and think that's gonna be fine cause it's fantasy.
So for you to tell other people what something is for them or what it should not be is never going to go over well.
Sure you can have a definition of the word, but what i compile into the genre of the tag and what others do is different. Specially with something so broad as ntr.
It is a matter of opinion and likes and dislikes and that is a hard subject for people to go,, alright i'll like it because you say i should.
Ntr is something on so many levels and likes and dislike for people i don't think if you are not very well embedded for years and years into the genre you will never understand it.
Some are really strict in what they consider ntr like you mentioned ::::::::

two girls were screwing around, and the main dick wasn't in the room

To me that is nothing. I don't even remotely consider that ntr. I consider that 1 big happy family. They can play,, i don't mind. I can't be everywhere all the time.
Like if i get to steal others their female partners in a game. Not a problem either.
But those distinctions in ntr are rarely made, or made clear beforehand.
But don't take a Li and let 5 guys run a train on her and then force her on me... Cause like in real life,, i would not touch that with a ten foot pole.
So..............
Me i have learned to stay well clear of the games that have the ntr tag + they tend to have more tags that make me run for the hills.
Futa, Gay, Trans, Trap, Bestiality, just to name a few.

I hope this makes things clearer for you from a none ntr lover and i wish you luck and subscribers in you endeavors..

 

[User_10575]

solo, no contest

 

[poract]

Never share >

 

[Deco]

I'd particularly like more games where the MC shares without having to be his friend, like something casual. I feel like most force a shared or fixed relationship at some point

 

[Chthonian]

To lighten things up his is a relevant and funny image.
Let's listen to the wise unicorn

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[Chthonian]

Sharing is gay

 

[Rogaldorn777]

Solo obviously. If spoils are "shared" then that ain't a harem anymore in my mind.

 

[nishaven]

It might sound hypocritical but only sharing I tolerate is when someone else shares their woman with MC. Because then it is more like netori instead of netorare.

 

[Jogur]

Nope, if I play a harem game it's for me alone.

 

[cosicosi89]

Solo of course. There is no such thing as sharing with other men in a harem.
It's not a harem after that.

Sharing is caring ... NOT!

It might sound hypocritical but only sharing I tolerate is when someone else shares their woman with MC. Because then it is more like netori instead of netorare.

Good point

 

[Ripowar]

My 2 cents: Solo harem is fine for me, but I like some exceptions to that as well.
I like harems, where (within it) everyone can play with everyone else, as long as the MC is involved.
Whether it's families, friends-with-benefits groups or any similar gatherings. Harems, where everyone consentually knows about and is fine to fool around.
I guess, that's more called a poly-relationship, where the MC is the center of it all.

What I don't like is forced sharing or wife/gf sharing with strangers as experiment a.s.o.

 

[dackma]

Never share

 

[newusers]

Never share.
Even that woman have another man.
I will make it mine.

 

[Wannabe]

It depends on the story, the situation, and other variables. Like most players, I guess, I prefer solo action with my harem. I haven't seen much group sex in these projects except for threesomes, but that could make for an interesting scene if it's done well.

 

[Impregnocon]

Solo I'm not really a big fan of sharing

 

[De2afasdfs@$]

I like no-NTR as a whole.
Avoidable NTR means the creator spent time making scenes with NTR which is a waste of time for me.
If a game has avoidable NTR, I'll probably just not bother with it until the game is finished.

Yeah it's like 90% of games with "avoidable NTR" has so much of it that it might as well instead be called "avoidable game".

 

[Oink]

NTR is Unnatural and biologically, subconsciously avoidable. When you see a girl with a male, it's an instant turn off, because your multi-million years evolved brain calculated it's for you and come to a conclusion: she might be infected by this guy's DNA / seed, so it's better to avoid her, due a lower chance of reproducing with this specie and giving her your own DNA / genes.

Animals rape the shit out of their "new mating partner" if one is already pregnant, to induce miscarriage and get her filled up again but with their own DNA.

Stop NTR, it's harmful for your genes! It's Anti-biological

I have no idea why you'd mix fiction and real life. Do you also stop watching a movie if the protagonist gets cheated on?

Porn games to me is exactly as it says, porn in form of a game. I don´t get possessive about the actors in the porn I watch and I don´t get possessive about som pixels getting getting fucked by some pixels, which is not the imaginary me. NTR is great sometimes and useless at other points. It´s all about how kinky it is.

Completely agree.
Porn is also a great way to watch (and to a lesser extent, experience) things that you wouldn't do (or can't do) in real life.
For instance, I love the game "Good Girl, Gone Bad". As I'll never be able to be Ashley, I can enjoy her adventures.
I get some people don't like certain things in fiction (violence, for instance), so everybody is free to choose what they want to watch, listen to or play, but to utterly reject everything that has NTR just because it has NTR is a little much.