discussion Proud Father (Off-Topic)

[Soobaru]

yes i have a few adult games from steam but they cant nail you for those.

There are some Steam games with lolisho or other more fringe/extreme/looked down upon content where the lewd, 18+ stuff has been cut, but the developer (or modders) offer a restoration patch.

 

[Schlong]

I had an idea for a game plot called "Westy's escape plan".
He get's many visitors accompanied with Lolis. Their goal is to corrupt/seduce all the guards and gather evidence against them, until he can blackmail his way out.

 

[Feral]

I had an idea for a game plot called "Westy's escape plan".
He get's many visitors accompanied with Lolis. Their goal is to corrupt/seduce all the guards and gather evidence against them, until he can blackmail his way out.

Other than his lawyer, I doubt he has visitors. Your plan would see you doing time. What makes you think that you would be allowed to take children into a prison with rockspiders in it

 

[angband]

Other than his lawyer, I doubt he has visitors. Your plan would see you doing time. What makes you think that you would be allowed to take children into a prison with rockspiders in it

Not to mention, given what we now know about him, it seems he is where he belongs.

 

[lewdcorner1]

I had an idea for a game plot called "Westy's escape plan".
He get's many visitors accompanied with Lolis. Their goal is to corrupt/seduce all the guards and gather evidence against them, until he can blackmail his way out.

Mr West allegedly hurt actual kids. Not just pretend kids. Not just pixels. Not just cartoon kids. He hurt real kids. He needs to stay in prison forever and ever.

As a funny concept for a game, however, it could be entertaining.

Scene 1: MC innocently doodling on a napkin, draws a naked cartoon of Lisa Simpson.
Scene 2: Authoritarian government discovers the cartoon, arrests MC and throws him in jail for 100 years.
Scene 3: Army of super lolis invades the jail, seduce all the guards, and frees MC from the authoritarian government.
Maybe the lolis have superpowers like the elves in "The Santa Clause."
"Tinsel, it's not just for decoration anymore"

 

[Freyr]

Mr West allegedly hurt actual kids. Not just pretend kids. Not just pixels. Not just cartoon kids. He hurt real kids. He needs to stay in prison forever and ever.

Alledgedly?

From what I know, you are now exaggerating a bit:

For the record, Westy was sentenced to 11 years and 7 months behind bars, and will not be eligible for parole until after 8 years and 4 months.

He served 113 days prior to the sentencing.

He pled guilty to:

* Possessing 577 pieces of actual CSAM content on devices seized from his home. Not animations or comics, but real photos & videos.
* Secretly filming three of his female neighbors.
* Creating Proud Father and other similar content.

The judge also threw the book at him because he felt he did not show any remorse or contrition, and exhibited "diagnosis of a p3dophilic disorder, as well as traits of a narcissistic and antisocial personality."

I'm not saying he's a flawless person but I never read that he actually hurt someone, minor or otherwise.

These things he pled guilty to, so I think we can remove the alledgedly on that part. But beyond that, I am not aware of anything else.

 

[3n69]

I'm noticing a large number of people are sorta separated on this issue, mostly in the stance that "They arrested a potential predator, therefore the ends justify the means."

To those of you that think this, I'm afraid that's not how this works. While it's true that there were plenty of reasons to book this guy, the way they found out is fundamentally unjustified. The only reason it's overlooked is because they genuinely lucked out this one time. And ultimately, it should be a separate case from his game design accusation.

The fact that the game design and his real world discrepancies are conflated to be in the same category is beyond wild. The only thing authorities did wrong is base this investigation off of a dude fantasizing. That's enough to put someone on maybe a list if done inappropriately, especially in a public setting, but this wasn't that.

The bigger issue here is that we are taking an isolated incident and having it validate every wrongful prosecution that's happened before and after. You're essentially saying "It's fine if we arrest 1000 innocents so long as we catch one real predator." That's what's known as a "Scorched-Earth Policy", and as we all know, that helps no one. Ever. Crusades, Witch Trials, Hays Code, Prohibition; these have all manifested violence and death in ways we couldn't have even dreamed throughout the centuries, and they all had the same mentality as this process.

 

[Kernist]

I'm noticing a large number of people are sorta separated on this issue, mostly in the stance that "They arrested a potential predator, therefore the ends justify the means."

To those of you that think this, I'm afraid that's not how this works. While it's true that there were plenty of reasons to book this guy, the way they found out is fundamentally unjustified. The only reason it's overlooked is because they genuinely lucked out this one time. And ultimately, it should be a separate case from his game design accusation.

The fact that the game design and his real world discrepancies are conflated to be in the same category is beyond wild. The only thing authorities did wrong is base this investigation off of a dude fantasizing. That's enough to put someone on maybe a list if done inappropriately, especially in a public setting, but this wasn't that.

The bigger issue here is that we are taking an isolated incident and having it validate every wrongful prosecution that's happened before and after. You're essentially saying "It's fine if we arrest 1000 innocents so long as we catch one real predator." That's what's known as a "Scorched-Earth Policy", and as we all know, that helps no one. Ever. Crusades, Witch Trials, Hays Code, Prohibition; these have all manifested violence and death in ways we couldn't have even dreamed throughout the centuries, and they all had the same mentality as this process.

But he was not innocent, Australia has very draconian laws regarding this kind of content, they didn't need to find anything more, the game was enough. He was not hunted on the basis of "let's pray there is more on his PC", he was hunted because according to Australian law it was already enough.

 

[3n69]

But he was not innocent, Australia has very draconian laws regarding this kind of content, they didn't need to find anything more, the game was enough. He was not hunted on the basis of "let's pray there is more on his PC", he was hunted because according to Australian law it was already enough.

I'm not saying that it wasn't within their laws to do so. I'm saying that arresting someone for having a thought is fundamentally wrong no matter where you come from.

 

[Kernist]

I'm not saying that it wasn't within their laws to do so. I'm saying that arresting someone for having a thought is fundamentally wrong no matter where you come from.

It's not a thought though. He was developing a game and he had this game on his PC, for sure. You may not agree with Australian law but it is what it is, they didn't "luck out", he just should know better.

 

[3n69]

It's not a thought though. He was developing a game and he had this game on his PC, for sure. You may not agree with Australian law but it is what it is, they didn't "luck out", he just should know better.

I see what you're getting at but that's not the discussion. Let's use a hypothetical and say there was nothing else besides the game on his PC. Would they still be justified in arresting him? As Bill Burr once said; in olden times it was legal to beat your wife because it was a domestic dispute. Does that make it okay? I'm not saying they should release the man, nor am I saying that they did anything against their laws. But it still stands that the system they use is fundamentally flawed.

Also for clarity: Making a game is no different than writing your unhinged thoughts in a tweet that's aimed towards nobody. Or writing a story or fanfic, just making it visual. In the end, it's a thought spoken aloud.

 

[Kernist]

I see what you're getting at but that's not the discussion. Let's use a hypothetical and say there was nothing else besides the game on his PC. Would they still be justified in arresting him? As Bill Burr once said; in olden times it was legal to beat your wife because it was a domestic dispute. Does that make it okay? I'm not saying they should release the man, nor am I saying that they did anything against their laws. But it still stands that the system they use is fundamentally flawed.

As far as I am aware yes, they would be justified. It's their country and their law. If I was from Australia or Canada I wouldn't even be here on this forum, too much of a risk. He was making this kind of content and he was taking money for it, if I was him I would gtfo from Australia asap.

 

[hawaii]

But is it really necessary to harass the developer like this just because he develops such games ?

 

[3n69]

As far as I am aware yes, they would be justified. It's their country and their law. If I was from Australia or Canada I wouldn't even be here on this forum, too much of a risk. He was making this kind of content and he was taking money for it, if I was him I would gtfo from Australia asap.

Real talk: Is that any different to how people thought about Germany in the 40s?

I get what you're saying though. No doubt. The guy should have just not did it given his location. That doesn't mean what they did was correct though, laws or not. Essentially what it comes down to is that they arrested him for an idea he said aloud. They then found evidence to push that narrative further in their direction. It worked in their favor. But this was just his case. This type of thing happens more than it should, and for even less than a game.

 

[Kernist]

Real talk: Is that any different to how people thought about Germany in the 40s?

I don't even know what nazis have to do with this. Every country has right to run itself as it wants. Australian law is very clear about it for a long time. Australia is a democratic country, if people wanted to change the law they would. They obviously are either ok with it or don't care enough to change it.

I think I will stop here, it's obvious your whole argument is "oh, but I just don't like it, by my values he didn't do anything wrong with the game alone". Yeah, by my values too, it still doesn't change anything.

 

[3n69]

I don't even know what nazis have to do with this. Every country has right to run itself as it wants. Australian law is very clear about it for a long time. Australia is a democratic country, if people wanted to change the law they would. They obviously are either ok with it or don't care enough to change it.

I think I will stop here, it's obvious your whole argument is "oh, but I just don't like it, by my values he didn't do anything wrong with the game alone". Yeah, by my values to, it still doesn't change anything.

Yes. My values in saying you (Yes, YOU) deserve the right to have your own means to express yourself in a safe environment where no one is hurt in the process, and that their laws essentially say "No you don't".

Which by the way, has everything to do with Nazis. It was kind of their whole deal.

To each their own though. I know a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their heads around that sentiment. I'm not trying to front you, but I am trying to tell you that that's all this comes down to, and where it leads the conversation at its core.

 

[MCH0w]

But is it really necessary to harass the developer like this just because he develops such games ?

To be honest, I don't know the country where authorities just could let you go away with this. If the game contains sexual connotation and has a character looks like a child, you are busted, they don't care if it's a fiction

 

[Kernist]

To be honest, I don't know the country where authorities just could let you go away with this. If the game contains sexual connotation and has a character looks like a child, you are busted, they don't care if it's a fiction

There are countries that openly allow it if it's an obvious fiction and even more countries where this is a grey area and nobody knows how laws would be interpreted if someone would be prosecuted for fiction.

 

[cherubin25]

Real talk: Is that any different to how people thought about Germany in the 40s?

I get what you're saying though. No doubt. The guy should have just not did it given his location. That doesn't mean what they did was correct though, laws or not. Essentially what it comes down to is that they arrested him for an idea he said aloud. They then found evidence to push that narrative further in their direction. It worked in their favor. But this was just his case. This type of thing happens more than it should, and for even less than a game.

I dont think you understand the concept of laws. What he was initially caught for, developing a game with Lolis, was not legal in his country. He knew about the risk and still did it, so yes, it is justified and it is also correct that he got caught for that. This has nothing to do with an "idea" he had or that they needed to look for something else, even if he only developed his game, he would have faced jailtime.

That he turned out to have the real deal and was also spying on women is indeed a lucky case for the authorities, but also for basically anyone else, because I am happy about everyone who has actual ** in their possession to be locked away.

 

[MattShizzle]

I don't even know what nazis have to do with this. Every country has right to run itself as it wants. Australian law is very clear about it for a long time. Australia is a democratic country, if people wanted to change the law they would. They obviously are either ok with it or don't care enough to change it.

I think I will stop here, it's obvious your whole argument is "oh, but I just don't like it, by my values he didn't do anything wrong with the game alone". Yeah, by my values too, it still doesn't change anything.

Because "it's their country and has the right to run it like that" is exactly what people thought about the Nazis and every other oppressive regime out there. It might be their law, but their law is incredibly fucked up. Unfortunately, there isn't a world system to stop countries from having repressive laws.