discussion Complete KN Ren'Py DAZ The family in trouble [v0.9] [lonely wolf]

[Nicest_Incest]

Which is another way of saying exactly what I said, only tying the gender of the possessive pronoun to the gender of the name, rather than the person. I was referring to the subject of the pronoun, not the subject of the entire sentence. In either case, in most non-English languages, the possessive noun does NOT agree with the gender of the name or the person, but of the object (the marriage, in this case).

Yeah the source of the problem is even inanimate objects have genders in non-English, which to native English speakers is weird as fuck. I took 4 years of French in HS (long since forgotten most of it) and most of my mistakes were because I forgot whether a fork or 10,000 other common objects was a boy or a girl. I suppose it would have eventually become 2nd nature if I moved from Cincinnati OH to Montreal or Paris, but I usually soon forgot about it after the test and finals.

 

[seanoh]

There is a lot to unravel with all the comments. First off the dev is relatively new and has only a small number of subs so it is likely that those supporters get to steer the ship in terms of how the story evolves one way or another. Too much anal? Yes - but that's according to my tastes. Perhaps the dev is heavily into that and or his main revenue stream has those particular tastes. Money talks - so if you want influence - cash to the dev gives your voice some volume. As for pronouns and spelling errors - yeah that shit is going to happen especially with works that undergo a translation. And if the dev is working solo or without a few 'testers' to catch mistakes - them mistakes are going to happen, so let's not spend a whole lot of energy on grammar or spelling because they will always be there. Is the story a game well no - I think there was only one choice (that I can remember) early on (touch or don't touch sleeping Chloe). But maybe there will be more. How many choices do you need to make it a game? Especially since most of the choices in games are non-consequential to overall outcomes. I know there are some devs out there who map out very complex paths etc. based on choices and those can be fun. But not every VN needs to be a game but every game needs to be a VN! So i you get a decent kinetic platform VN with few if any choices then perhaps you should just accept it for what it is. Or once again sub up and use your money voice to sway the dev. The good points of the story are that the sex is front and centre...no slow burn...with promises whose only purpose is to keep subs subbing. Could some of the characters be better. Yes. The dev seems to like 'em chunky and wide...oh well not my thing, but again he who creates the tune gets to pick the tempo. I honestly think the dev in many ways is learning as they go, both in working with the art and also with the story telling. Hopefully after this one the dev comes back with a new set of characters and a more even sexual playing field. All anal all the time for as many chapters as we've had can become tiresome.

 

[Gametimer]

Here's my unofficial android port of The Family in Trouble v0.6

Download

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Spoiler: Features

Swipe Down - Hide Ui
Swipe Left - Rollback
Swipe Right - Start Skipping Text
Swipe Up - Save Your Game
Swipe Up and Down - Enable Auto Forward Mode
Opacity Slider and Text Size on Preferences

Spoiler: Saves location

All saves are located on Documents > Cebs
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Thanks for the Android Port Cebs!

 

[Deleted member 38337]

The Family In Trouble [0.6] Compressed (Tested)

Win (1.1 GB/ 196 MB) :

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[Republican Bear]

Love it though I still wonder why/how the MC lost his memories. Hopefully future flashbacks explore that.

 

[bombthetwist]

french translation 0.6 just here

 

[seronis]

Which is another way of saying exactly what I said, only tying the gender of the possessive pronoun to the gender of the name, rather than the person. I was referring to the subject of the pronoun, not the subject of the entire sentence. In either case, in most non-English languages, the possessive noun does NOT agree with the gender of the name or the person, but of the object (the marriage, in this case).

and thats why I didnt say subject. because its no different for objects. A pronoun matches whatever word it replaces. If its replacing an object it matches the object. The farms cows == its cows. "john was upset at the government" == "john was upset at it". Subject is not impotant. Sentience is not important. A pronoun matches what it replaces or its NOT a pronoun. The entire meaning of a pronoun is a generic word that stands in for a specific word. If you dont match what you replaced, you're not a pronoun at all. You're gibberish

 

[Nastastic]

and thats why I didnt say subject. because its no different for objects. A pronoun matches whatever word it replaces. If its replacing an object it matches the object. The farms cows == its cows. "john was upset at the government" == "john was upset at it". Subject is not impotant. Sentience is not important. A pronoun matches what it replaces or its NOT a pronoun. The entire meaning of a pronoun is a generic word that stands in for a specific word. If you dont match what you replaced, you're not a pronoun at all. You're gibberish

I don't know which of us has the bigger need to be right here.

Anyway, I was explaining why machine translation has such issues sussing out whether to use "his" or "her" when translating to English from languages in which the possessive pronoun might as well be "their" in the sense that the word does not change whether the person to whom the possessive pronoun "belongs" (the subject) is male or female, because in the foreign language the pronoun takes its gender from the object to which it refers, whether the "object" is a person or an actual inanimate object (and in English gender is not generally assigned to inanimate objects, except in specific, semi-archaic senses with things like ships and sometimes cars). Using French as an example: his (Bob's) car = sa voiture, her (Ann's) car = sa voiture; his (Bob's) truck = son camion, her (Ann's) truck = son camion. In English the possessive derives its gender from the gender of Bob or Ann (the subject). In French the possessive derives its gender from the gender of car/voiture or truck/camion (the object) so Google Translate can not tell from "sa" or "son" to whom the vehicle belongs, as in whether that person is male or female (despite the name Bob or Ann being in the sentence, because the algorithm is not that advanced yet). So it will randomly spit out "her" or "his" and sometimes both within the same sentence.

 

[npYEcxrEAq3]

You're conflating two things, Nastastic.

1. Different possessive pronouns depending on the possessor.
2. Different inflections of the same possessive pronoun depending on the possession.

Different languages may have one or the other or (like German) both.

English	French	German
His father is dead.	Son père est mort.	Sein Vater ist tot.
His mother is dead.	Sa mère est morte.	Seine Mutter ist tot.
Her father is dead.	Son père est mort.	Ihr Vater ist tot.
Her mother is dead.	Sa mère est morte.	Ihre Mutter ist tot.

 

[Deleted member 28264]

That's one of the great loli games, can't wait for the next version!
I wish the developer had a discord server, though.

 

[Nastastic]

You're conflating two things, Nastastic.

1. Different possessive pronouns depending on the possessor.
2. Different inflections of the same possessive pronoun depending on the possession.

Different languages may have one or the other or (like German) both.

English	French	German
His father is dead.	Son père est mort.	Sein Vater ist tot.
His mother is dead.	Sa mère est morte.	Seine Mutter ist tot.
Her father is dead.	Son père est mort.	Ihr Vater ist tot.
Her mother is dead.	Sa mère est morte.	Ihre Mutter ist tot.

Your breakdown is prettier than mine. It also looks like German adds an extra wrinkle to the problem.

But I don't think it invalidates the point I was trying to make about the limits of machine translation.

What I am sure about is that no one besides me, you and seronis gives a fuck about this conversation.

 

[Tiur]

What I am sure about is that no one besides me, you and seronis gives a fuck about this conversation.

I don't care either way about the results of the conversation, but I'm reading it because I am fascinated with linguistics even if I never got around to studying it.

 

[PopPop]

I don't care either way about the results of the conversation, but I'm reading it because I am fascinated with linguistics even if I never got around to studying it.

I am very fascinated with cunnilinguistics...

 

[seronis]

Your breakdown is prettier than mine. It also looks like German adds an extra wrinkle to the problem.

But I don't think it invalidates the point I was trying to make about the limits of machine translation.

What I am sure about is that no one besides me, you and seronis gives a fuck about this conversation.

My issue is that its no longer a pronoun if you dont match the word you are replacing. Its just a particle. The french above isnt saying 'his' or 'her' mother. Its just saying 'the' mother because you lost the information about who the owner was. Which means its not a translated sentence. Its just a different sentence

 

[Tiur]

My issue is that its no longer a pronoun if you dont match the word you are replacing. Its just a particle. The french above isnt saying 'his' or 'her' mother. Its just saying 'the' mother because you lost the information about who the owner was. Which means its not a translated sentence. Its just a different sentence

This isn't accurate. "The mother" in French would be "La mère", while "The father"would be "Le père". "Se" or "Sa" is a possessive article where "Se" replaces "his" or "her" or "their" or "its" when applied to a masculine noun like "father", while "Sa" does the same for a feminine noun like "mother"... Because in French, the gender of the object is what determines the gender of the pronoun or article.

The mother = "La mère"; the father = "Le père"
My mother = "Ma mère"; my father = "Mon père" - regardless of my gender
Your mother = "Ta mère" (informal only, to a single person); your father (same conditions) = "Ton père" - regardless of your gender
His mother = "Sa mère"; his father = "Son père"
Her mother = "Sa mère"; her father = "Son père"
Its mother = "Sa mère"; its father = "Son père"

Note the last three. THAT'S why gendered article translation has trouble.

There are also non-gendered articles in French, which complicates things EVEN MORE:
Your mother = "Votre mère" (formal or to more than one person); your father (same conditions) = "Votre père"
Our mother = "Notre mère"; our father = "Notre père"
Their mother = "Leur mère"; their father = "Leur père"

Fundamentally, it's important to realize that the way gender works on language is significantly different from language to language.

 

[Tiur]

If you wanted to translate possessive pronouns specifically, here's another example from French (since it's the non-English language I know best):

"The book is his" = "Le livre est le sien."
"The book is hers" = ALSO "Le livre est le sien."
"The shovel is his" = "La pelle est la sienne."
"The shovel is hers" = ALSO "La pelle est la sienne."

In these cases, "le sien" means "his or hers or its, but with a masculine subject", while "la sienne" means "his or hers or its, but with a feminine subject".

You do not know from a French singular third-person possessive pronoun what the gender of the possessor is. It's just not part of the language.

 

[User_11218]

Good game, good game?

 

[User_35004]

A VN so "deep" into anal it ended up being quite funny to be honest. My main criticism is that Chloe turns too quickly into a cock-hungry slut. I'd rather see corruption and psychological maneuvres. But it's only a personal preference. Also the MC really needs to get a job, most scenes start with him just sitting on his ass on the couch watching TV

 

[hawaii]

WHHHHHHHYYYYY do you want to end that GOOOOOD Game !!! Are you sure ? Where is UPDATE 7 . Sir

 

[User_24048]

Everytime I download a android port of yours, i get a

Here's my unofficial android port of The Family in Trouble v0.6

Download

You must be registered to see links

You must be registered to see links

You must be registered to see links

​

Spoiler: Features

Swipe Down - Hide Ui
Swipe Left - Rollback
Swipe Right - Start Skipping Text
Swipe Up - Save Your Game
Swipe Up and Down - Enable Auto Forward Mode
Opacity Slider and Text Size on Preferences

Spoiler: Saves location

All saves are located on Documents > Cebs
..::GRANT PERMISSION ON FIRST RUN::..

You must be registered to see attachments