discussion Ren'Py DAZ Revelations of Whispering Pines [Chapter 2] [Blackheart Games]

[BadJM]

I have noticed James has no "DECEASED" stamp written over his picture in the notepad, unlike Donny or Monique who are most likely dead for good. On the other hand, John's wife Wynona who is reported dead, but apparently not dead, as the game implies, doesn't have this stamp. Does it mean the James is still alive and we still have two MCs in one game. That would be weird since they basically fuck the same girls.

Usually I would say that it would be almost impossible for him to still be alive, but since it's story written by seath, I think anything is possible.
I do think it would be kind of lame if he is still alive.

 

[Beduin123]

Usually I would say that it would be almost impossible for him to still be alive, but since it's story written by seath, I think anything is possible.

That's what I also say

I do think it would be kind of lame if he is still alive.

Nevertheless, my observation stands. Wynona is the example.

Spoiler

She is most probably still alive. The Mother is another example. She was shot right in the head but she is most probably alive.

 

[BadJM]

That's what I also say



Nevertheless, my observation stands. Wynona is the example.

Spoiler

She is most probably still alive. The Mother is another example. She was shot right in the head but she is most probably alive.

The mother stuff, I think everyone assumed she was still alive, we never really saw her face so it could just be anyone posing as her that got shot.

 

[Beduin123]

The mother stuff, I think everyone assumed she was still alive, we never really saw her face so it could just be anyone posing as her that got shot.

IDK, I personally believed that she had gone for good and felt quite relieved that I didn't have to do with that "mysterious" BS any more. Honestly, with each new release of BH games I feel less and less excited. TLG is the one that still keeps me interested but there is that annoying girl who is like the Mother-light-version who spoils anticipation as well.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

IDK, I personally believed that she had gone for good and felt quite relieved that I didn't have to do with that "mysterious" BS any more. Honestly, with each new release of BH games I feel less and less excited. TLG is the one that still keeps me interested but there is that annoying girl who is like the Mother-light-version who spoils anticipation as well.

Yeah a bit of mystery and drama is ok but lately it's meh. Mafia shit = ok, I can handle that. Mafia + dark magic shit too = umm, what? I can't speak for everybody but going to guess most of us just want to molest some lolis, preferably our own daughters after grooming them, and guide a simpler story with some choices so just a basic simple slice-of-life of a closeted ped0's misadventures and triumphs would probably do just as well, even if that mostly wouldn't fit in the BH universe and cameo appearances from it would feel weird.

 

[BadJM]

The only game right now, that I am not as excited about as I used to be is PA. I think this one is a massive improvement from SoWP and TLG has been really good so far.
PA kind of lost its identity, almost every update, the mc goes on some side quest that doesn't really have much to do with the original premise of the game.

 

[Beduin123]

I can't speak for everybody but going to guess most of us just want to molest some lolis, preferably our own daughters after grooming them, and guide a simpler story with some choices so just a basic simple slice-of-life of a closeted ped0's misadventures and triumphs would probably do just as well, even if that mostly wouldn't fit in the BH universe and cameo appearances from it would feel weird.

Yeah, it's called Proud Father or SSP

think this one is a massive improvement from SoWP

Really? I think the same shit or even worse. Because on the top of the Father "mystery", which turned out as a big disappointment, we have also Mother "mystery" (I put both in commas because the mystery in the first game is just fake, it has never been properly developed or explained). OK, what's next? Grandfather and Grandmother?

On the top of that is all this dark shit like rape, abuse etc. I'm not shocked with it, just bored. That's what you do when you have no skills or wits to seduce a girl in a different way. Slow corruption of the lolies, when they become willing and eager participants of your kinks is so much better. Also, Seath loves sleep sex in his games and I cannot imagine anything more boring than that. It's just ultra low effort like fucking a rubber doll.

I repeat once more. Seath is great when it comes to creating interesting engaging characters. But as a writer of exciting coherent stories he sucks.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

Yeah, it's called Proud Father or SSP





Really? I think the same shit or even worse. Because on the top of the Father "mystery", which turned out as a big disappointment, we have also Mother "mystery" (I put both in commas because the mystery in the first game is just fake, it is never been properly developed or explained). OK, what's next? Grandfather and Grandmother?

On the top of that is all this dark shit. I'm not shocked with it, just bored. Slow corruption of the lolies, when they become willing and eager participants of your kinks is so much better. Also, Seath loves sleep sex and I cannot imagine anything more boring than that. It's just low effort like fucking a rubber doll.

I repeat once more. Seath is great when it comes to creating interesting engaging characters. But as a writer of exciting coherent stories he sucks.

Yeah I think he's stuck writing his own shit because of lolis (hard to get reliable help for that) but if he hired out the writing like he does the coding and just do everything else himself it'd prob be far better, maybe, though if he tells them "it has to be dark", that ties one arm behind their back so to speak. Stephen King's earlier stuff is kinda dark (eg Misery) but not many can pull that off at all, let alone with sex scenes added in a porno story.

 

[BadJM]

Yeah, it's called Proud Father or SSP





Really? I think the same shit or even worse. Because on the top of the Father "mystery", which turned out as a big disappointment, we have also Mother "mystery" (I put both in commas because the mystery in the first game is just fake, it has never been properly developed or explained). OK, what's next? Grandfather and Grandmother?

On the top of that is all this dark shit like rape, abuse etc. I'm not shocked with it, just bored. That's what you do when you have no skills or wits to seduce a girl in a different way. Slow corruption of the lolies, when they become willing and eager participants of your kinks is so much better. Also, Seath loves sleep sex in his games and I cannot imagine anything more boring than that. It's just ultra low effort like fucking a rubber doll.

I repeat once more. Seath is great when it comes to creating interesting engaging characters. But as a writer of exciting coherent stories he sucks.

I mean seath games will always have dark elements to the story. I actually liked the mystery with the father stuff, but the problem with seath's games was that he tried to make all the stories super interconnected and SoWP ended up being the game that got screwed the most because of that. The pacing of the game was also super fast, the whole story happens in like a week so it became really hard to develop the relationships with the girls and the mc. They were just jumping from one big story event to the other. I remember seath making a post on his discord saying that he was having a really hard time writing sex scenes for the game because of it.
I think this game solved a lot of those issues. It has a slower pace, and he is actually trying to have the mc interact more with the girls.

 

[Beduin123]

Yeah I think he's stuck writing his own shit because of lolis (hard to get reliable help for that) but if he hired out the writing like he does the coding and just do everything else himself it'd prob be far better, maybe, though if he tells them "it has to be dark", that ties one arm behind their back so to speak. Stephen King's earlier stuff is kinda dark (eg Misery) but not many can pull that off.

I think loli stuff has contributed most to his popularity because of The Guardian. BHH was low grade low quality stuff with an extremely messy plot that would confuse even a junkie. TG had success because of the lolis and relatively coherent story. Also initially PA was welcomed, though it is rather about hebes not lolis. SoWP didn't get much love either because the story was also a mess.

From now I guess every new game is going to be about lolis and mostly dark, because that's what people like and want. But even his most popular game, The Guardian needs to be trimmed in order to cut out 50% of water which is the stuff unnecessary either for the plot or for faps that is very badly written and leads nowhere. In this game, it is the same. Half of the stuff do not contribute to the story or character development just side quests. It's already messy as fuck even in the second update.

the problem with seath's games was that he tried to make all the stories super interconnected and SoWP ended up being the game that got screwed the most because of that.

That in particular doesn't bother me much. I even like some cameo from other games. There are lots of characters in his games that do not come from a different game but still feel unnecessary and alien.

I think this game solved a lot of those issues. It has a slower pace, and he is actually trying to have the mc interact more with the girls.

Except that the MC has to fuck the double share of the girls from both games. And most of the ppl do not remember already who is who

 

[burn'dem]

I do wonder if Seath's afraid that if he does a non-rape focused game without the whole Father universe stuff in it that it'll get way more popular than his connected games.

 

[BadJM]

I do wonder if Seath's afraid that if he does a non-rape focused game without the whole Father universe stuff in it that it'll get way more popular than his connected games.

I don't see why he would be afraid of that, at the end of the day he wants to make money with his games. If one of his games gets super popular. that would be good for him. I think he just finds the games boring if they don't have some dark elements to the story.

 

[yoyomistro]

I don't see why he would be afraid of that, at the end of the day he wants to make money with his games. If one of his games gets super popular. that would be good for him. I think he just finds the games boring if they don't have some dark elements to the story.

Yea, for some reason people have way too many normative attachments to sexual storytelling. They think if you're writing/drawing/rendering something dark, it's a reflection of some deep desire to exercise something IRL, whereas most people wouldn't accuse Stephen King of being a sociopath for writing almost exclusively horror and thrillers. If someone asked, "Why doesn't SK write a good romance novel once in a while?", they'd probably rightly get some weird stares. Maybe Rockstar Games should do an adaptation of The Notebook while we're at it? Just to prove they aren't a bunch of antisocial loons and for a change of pace for their mental health?

These are unserious questions. Every horror movie studio would probably make a ton more money if they all started making some version of Cocomelon. There are enough parents out there looking to dump their spawn in front of a screen that the market would be difficult to oversaturate. People enjoy making certain kinds of art because they enjoy exploring certain concepts and motifs; very rarely is it a reflection of some underlying desire to exact some evil on the world, and in those cases, you can usually tell by the low quality of the work, and a sort of "desperation" reflected in their storytelling. Yes, there are weak points to BHG's storytelling, especially in his early work--but those are more a reflection of stylistic preference and inexperience, not antisocial desires. You can see his pacing skills increase over time, which is perfectly normal for most amateur writers as they hone their craft to a professional level.

Also anytime I see this concern trolling, I wonder if these people really think they're the first person to say such a thing, or they think if it reaches critical mass they'll force the target of their "concern" to change their storytelling preferences? Always an interesting insight into the thought process of the people on the other side of the telecom lines and keyboards.

 

[Beduin123]

Yea, for some reason people have way too many normative attachments to sexual storytelling.

I don't. As I said, I'm not a fan of these dark elements but they neither shock nor repel me. I also like lolies and group sex and all kind of kinks.

It's inconsistencies in the plot, unnecessary twists that make the plot jerky, all the "mystery" gaslighting and in general the feeling that the stories do not have clear direction and as the result are messy as fuck, that's what makes me disappointed in the games of this, no doubt, talented Dev. All he needs is to sit down and write a clean clear interesting story (even just a general outline of it) BEFORE he starts making a game, and then just follow it gradually growing the meat on those bones.

Instead he tries to surprise us with illogical twists taken out of thin air, which often turn the plot and character arcs 180 degrees around, to shock us with the dark elements, again just "because the character is psycho", and to gaslight us with all the fake mystery and horror elements that often don't get any feasible explanation, just become forgotten and overwritten by yet another mystery or plot twist.

I have an impression that he usually doesn't even know what will happen in the next update, just throws the shit at the wall at random and sees what sticks.

 

[hambone1234]

My 2 Cents: TIme would be better spend on the PA & Dire Desire updates. Games like Whispering Pines or Guardian require too much knowledge of the Blackheart backstory (which is complicated to say the least).

I respect your guys preference to tell your own story. And I'll pay attention to that story regardless of which is released first... but certain games are tough to get into. To me, this is one of the tough ones

 

[yoyomistro]

I don't. As I said, I'm not a fan of these dark elements but they neither shock nor repel me. I also like lolies and group sex and all kind of kinks.

It's inconsistencies in the plot, unnecessary twists that make the plot jerky, all the "mystery" gaslighting and in general the feeling that the stories do not have clear direction and as the result are messy as fuck, that's what makes me disappointed in the games of this, no doubt, talented Dev. All he needs is to sit down and write a clean clear interesting story (even just a general outline of it) BEFORE he starts making a game, and then just follow it gradually growing the meat on those bones.

Instead he tries to surprise us with illogical twists taken out of thin air, which often turn the plot and character arcs 180 degrees around, to shock us with the dark elements, again just "because the character is psycho", and to gaslight us with all the fake mystery and horror elements that often don't get any feasible explanation, just become forgotten and overwritten by yet another mystery or plot twist.

I have an impression that he usually doesn't even know what will happen in the next update, just throws the shit at the wall at random and sees what sticks.

Oh yea, I agree on that lol. If you'd made that specific critique in the initial post I would have been 100% with you. I do feel like Seath goes for these grand, overarching themes, complex machinations, and covert designs, but doesn't do well on any sort of payoff. Let's say the character(s) being focused on are supposed to be schizo in some way, and we're seeing things from their perspective. There's a way to do it that feels satisfying and allows and outsider to empathize with their experience, like in A Beautiful Mind. I haven't gotten to this particular work yet, but from what I've seen it suffers as much from what you've laid out as his earlier works. He probably gets too caught up in specific events driving the excitement and retaining attention, instead of being mindful of the flow and mechanics of writing, and in the end you overstimulate the reader and the leap from peak to peak winds up feeling rather flat; like the experience of alcohol to an alcoholic vs. someone who drinks only when socializing with friends or at major events.

I think Seath would do well to train a bit with formal rhetorical analysis. If he could learn to deploy those mechanics, and then apply them to his own work, it would take his output to the next level, and increase his ability to really allow the reader to appreciate the minds of his characters and the ebbs and flows of his stories.

EDIT: I think my last post was agreeing with BadJM's quote of Burn'dem's post not yours. I think I largely agreed with most points of your last post.

 

[burn'dem]

Yea, for some reason people have way too many normative attachments to sexual storytelling. They think if you're writing/drawing/rendering something dark, it's a reflection of some deep desire to exercise something IRL, whereas most people wouldn't accuse Stephen King of being a sociopath for writing almost exclusively horror and thrillers. If someone asked, "Why doesn't SK write a good romance novel once in a while?", they'd probably rightly get some weird stares. Maybe Rockstar Games should do an adaptation of The Notebook while we're at it? Just to prove they aren't a bunch of antisocial loons and for a change of pace for their mental health?

These are unserious questions. Every horror movie studio would probably make a ton more money if they all started making some version of Cocomelon. There are enough parents out there looking to dump their spawn in front of a screen that the market would be difficult to oversaturate. People enjoy making certain kinds of art because they enjoy exploring certain concepts and motifs; very rarely is it a reflection of some underlying desire to exact some evil on the world, and in those cases, you can usually tell by the low quality of the work, and a sort of "desperation" reflected in their storytelling. Yes, there are weak points to BHG's storytelling, especially in his early work--but those are more a reflection of stylistic preference and inexperience, not antisocial desires. You can see his pacing skills increase over time, which is perfectly normal for most amateur writers as they hone their craft to a professional level.

Also anytime I see this concern trolling, I wonder if these people really think they're the first person to say such a thing, or they think if it reaches critical mass they'll force the target of their "concern" to change their storytelling preferences? Always an interesting insight into the thought process of the people on the other side of the telecom lines and keyboards.

I don't. As I said, I'm not a fan of these dark elements but they neither shock nor repel me. I also like lolies and group sex and all kind of kinks.

It's inconsistencies in the plot, unnecessary twists that make the plot jerky, all the "mystery" gaslighting and in general the feeling that the stories do not have clear direction and as the result are messy as fuck, that's what makes me disappointed in the games of this, no doubt, talented Dev. All he needs is to sit down and write a clean clear interesting story (even just a general outline of it) BEFORE he starts making a game, and then just follow it gradually growing the meat on those bones.

Instead he tries to surprise us with illogical twists taken out of thin air, which often turn the plot and character arcs 180 degrees around, to shock us with the dark elements, again just "because the character is psycho", and to gaslight us with all the fake mystery and horror elements that often don't get any feasible explanation, just become forgotten and overwritten by yet another mystery or plot twist.

I have an impression that he usually doesn't even know what will happen in the next update, just throws the shit at the wall at random and sees what sticks.

Sorry my point wasn't about the dark elements. I only said "non-rape" because he does have a game disconnected from the father plot but it's extremely focused on being the darkest non-con game he can make so it's more niche than PA or TLG etc.

I'm just wondering out loud if he holds himself back from making a game similar in content to his main ones but without the father universe stuff because deep down he knows a lot of people don't care about it anymore.

 

[Beduin123]

TIme would be better spend on the PA & Dire Desire updates.

I liked the PA in the earlier updates when it was just a straight up corruption and domination story but now it is as messy as their other games if not more. It lost direction half way and also now mingled up with this game too much, getting contaminated and buried under all these BS "plot twists" and "mystery".

 

[Bollagus]

So, no compressed version 2?

 

[nosbos]

With the Ketzal wave, my nsfw account got banned. After making a new one I tried to join the Blackheart discord through the invite link here. It says that invitations are paused, which seems plausible for the moment. Is there a way around it to get readded again on the server?
Thanks