discussion Abandoned VN Ren'Py DAZ SUCH A SHARP PAIN [V0.11.7R] [KETZAL]

[ady13]

I mean issue is that this is a piracy site, most things here are shared against most devs consent right? the site need a clear indication what it is and threat everyone equally and not picky , this site lacks consistancy and you cant blame its members when you theat some things differently, some games gets updated instantly on the day its released, some after 3 weeks etc.
Also to what @ketzal said, biggest barrier into making games like this is access to monetize it, Patreon etc dont allow this and other sites is hard to get into, SS takes up to like a year sometimes to be accepted
Also if you make a good game you will have alot of subscribers no matter what, alot of games that are shared on F95 have alot of subscribers if game is actually good and if anything the site exposure make you more money that you would ever made without the piracy sites exposures, you need to understand most people that play only games for free will never support you no matter what and people who like ur game and can support you will also support you no matter if they get the game for free or not as i also do, i personally play the game for free and if is good i go subscribe after, i never pay for something i dont know if ill enjoy. So yeah anyone who will make a good quality game will always make good money, theres literally 0 cases where thats not the case unless the Dev dont really care that much bout money etc. Also big % of devs that suddenly got alot of subscribers and made bank actually slow down alot and either take 9 months for half a update *cough Radiant* or abandon the game.
So yeah alot of devs in process to maximize their profit actually end up loosing more long term , you cant catch all the fishes from the tank, saying piracy sites kill games or scare devs to create games is dumb , thats just an excuse for bad devs that make shitty games and try to blame anything but them for their failure. You need to accept the goods and the bads whenever you commit to something

 

[soulsnatcher]

clem has one of the most beautiful faces i've seen in any media. woah.

 

[Tiur]

I mean issue is that this is a piracy site, most things here are shared against most devs consent right? the site need a clear indication what it is and threat everyone equally and not picky , this site lacks consistancy and you cant blame its members when you theat some things differently, some games gets updated instantly on the day its released, some after 3 weeks etc.

The kind of absolutism you're suggesting is a bad idea, because it either drives devs away from a potential feedback/support channel, or it makes the forum useless. Using judgement is important when walking a thin line between engagement and support and public access to the games.

This is what I would consider the ideal method for a piracy forum that also respects devs (and this is really the only one that even comes close):

• Regardless of dev activity, if a game is leaked elsewhere, links should be allowed to be posted here.
  • There's no good reason crippling the site's usability if the cat's already out of the bag somewhere else.
• If the dev is not active in the thread or isn't on the forum, links should be allowed to be posted whenever someone leaks them.
  • This incentivizes devs to come to this forum and engage/communicate.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, and the game has regular public releases, links should be posted when the public version goes public, preferably by the dev themselves.
  • This is important to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time to incentivize supporters. No support incentive = no support = dev burnout/abandonment.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, but the game does not have regular public releases, or it has very long periods between supporter release and public release (greater than 30 days), generally speaking people should let a reasonable amount of time pass (15-30 days is the most common range I've seen considered "reasonable") before leaking the update.
  • This is to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time like the previous entry, but putting that timeline more in line with the rest of the industry.
  • Yes, this means devs who do not want public releases at all are somewhat screwed here, but they really should understand that this is how the industry works.

 

[ady13]

The kind of absolutism you're suggesting is a bad idea, because it either drives devs away from a potential feedback/support channel, or it makes the forum useless. Using judgement is important when walking a thin line between engagement and support and public access to the games.

This is what I would consider the ideal method for a piracy forum that also respects devs (and this is really the only one that even comes close):

• Regardless of dev activity, if a game is leaked elsewhere, links should be allowed to be posted here.
  • There's no good reason crippling the site's usability if the cat's already out of the bag somewhere else.
• If the dev is not active in the thread or isn't on the forum, links should be allowed to be posted whenever someone leaks them.
  • This incentivizes devs to come to this forum and engage/communicate.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, and the game has regular public releases, links should be posted when the public version goes public, preferably by the dev themselves.
  • This is important to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time to incentivize supporters. No support incentive = no support = dev burnout/abandonment.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, but the game does not have regular public releases, or it has very long periods between supporter release and public release (greater than 30 days), generally speaking people should let a reasonable amount of time pass (15-30 days is the most common range I've seen considered "reasonable") before leaking the update.
  • This is to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time like the previous entry, but putting that timeline more in line with the rest of the industry.
  • Yes, this means devs who do not want public releases at all are somewhat screwed here, but they really should understand that this is how the industry works.

If games have to leak somewhere else first then they might be posted here than people will just use the site that will be posted first, id say 1 week delay for release is more than enough and should be a good balance for devs and members, again you cant catch all the fishes in the tank, if some1 waited 1 week he can wait 1 more week to get it for free ,15-30 days is way too long, some games even release updates faster than 15-30 days, people will just go use the site they get their shit quicker if you make it too inconvenient

 

[Tiur]

If games have to leak somewhere else first then they might be posted here than people will just use the site that will be posted first, id say 1 week delay for release is more than enough and should be a good balance for devs and members, again you cant catch all the fishes in the tank, if some1 waited 1 week he can wait 1 more week to get it for free ,15-30 days is way too long, some games even release updates faster than 15-30 days, people will just go use the site they get their shit quicker if you make it too inconvenient

This again is making the assumption that any one of these options is true for all games, which is not the case. Alternately, it is reading my first bullet point and pretending the rest of the bullet points don't exist.

Games that update faster than 1 month are few and far between, and those generally don't get leaked at all, people just wait for the public updates. One week is, flat-out, too short. 15 days is just over two weeks.

Now, IF every game that has supporter->free cadence of 30 days got leaked instantly on other sites, you'd have a point, but that's just not true. It just... doesn't really happen in the frequency you're suggesting. Besides, people aren't going to go to other sites if we just cascade external leaks here, since this is still the best place to find Restricted-flair games all in the same place.

I can give examples if needed, but I don't want to encourage people to start leaking them just to spite what I'm saying here.

The point I was making is that we can be respectful of participatory devs to a reasonable degree while ALSO cascading external leaks here. They're not super-common.

 

[User_12]

I mean issue is that this is a piracy site, most things here are shared against most devs consent right? the site need a clear indication what it is and threat everyone equally and not picky , this site lacks consistancy and you cant blame its members when you theat some things differently, some games gets updated instantly on the day its released, some after 3 weeks etc.
Also to what @ketzal said, biggest barrier into making games like this is access to monetize it, Patreon etc dont allow this and other sites is hard to get into, SS takes up to like a year sometimes to be accepted
Also if you make a good game you will have alot of subscribers no matter what, alot of games that are shared on F95 have alot of subscribers if game is actually good and if anything the site exposure make you more money that you would ever made without the piracy sites exposures, you need to understand most people that play only games for free will never support you no matter what and people who like ur game and can support you will also support you no matter if they get the game for free or not as i also do, i personally play the game for free and if is good i go subscribe after, i never pay for something i dont know if ill enjoy. So yeah anyone who will make a good quality game will always make good money, theres literally 0 cases where thats not the case unless the Dev dont really care that much bout money etc. Also big % of devs that suddenly got alot of subscribers and made bank actually slow down alot and either take 9 months for half a update *cough Radiant* or abandon the game.
So yeah alot of devs in process to maximize their profit actually end up loosing more long term , you cant catch all the fishes from the tank, saying piracy sites kill games or scare devs to create games is dumb , thats just an excuse for bad devs that make shitty games and try to blame anything but them for their failure. You need to accept the goods and the bads whenever you commit to something

I almost agree with everything you say. But people need to understand that supporting an artist (I don't define myself as such, but hey...) is first and foremost financial.
Let me explain, before doing SSP I had an office job (in IT) and I wasn't really fulfilling myself. I was doing 3D in the evenings and at weekends. But I was too ashamed of my work to publish it. I found all my images passable, if not garbage (which is still the case). Events I won't mention here, and my wife's insistence, pushed me to publish my work. Thanks to people's support, I was able to quit a job that wasn't fulfilling me, and today I spend all my time creating SSP. So if people don't support me, I'll go back to my office job and SSP will be slowed down or even stopped.

SSP is free, completely free and always will be. But without money, there can be no development. I'm not asking anyone to pay for the game (again, it's free). I make it available to people myself the same 30 days after I make it available to my subs.
I understand piracy, but I don't understand stealing from an artist.
On my SS you'll find 4K images and weekly DEV LOGS (I've never gone more than a week without commenting on my life or work). Comics, bonuses etc...
So I feel I give people enough material for the money.
In 12 months, I've developed 4 different versions of SSP (not to mention the minor versions and patches). December 2022 saw the release of V0.5 and December 2023 saw the release of V0.9. So as I'm committed to my subscribers, it takes me an average of 3 months to release a version.
I believe in respecting my subs, so I don't understand the desire of some people to want the same privileges as someone who spends their (hard-earned) money supporting my work.
Piracy yes (everything should be free on the internet), preventing an artist from making a living from his ART no.

You talk about crappy games (I consider SSP an average game), I think subs know the difference between supporting a crappy game and a dedicated creator. I myself support 3 other creators (whom I won't name here) and believe me, all the creators I know, respect their subs and are passionate about their ART.

Please respect the creators, financially if you can, or by being patient if you can't financially. If you don't like a game, don't play it, rather than destroy an artist in the making. Everything would be simpler and more pleasant if creators were honored for their skills and gamers were ready to support their favorite games.

 

[King]

Because here, we actually do respect the Devs. If the game was released in other places, there's not much we can do about that. But Ketzal is earnest. Often releasing the game bug-free to the public. Early releases are often filled with bugs than not. A little trust can go a long way.

Ohh so it's a rule that you don't share any version which is not publicly available. So no leaked version get posted here of any game?
Or is this respect is selective I wonder

Every thread should only feature public release then. And I wonder what rule that guy who posted the link violated ?
I have seen people positing links on the site before it didn't got deleted.

So if you are not a RESPECTED dev in the forum it's fine if the game got released before the public release.
As I said have no problem waiting for public release but what about the time frame, if a dev decide 6 months or a year how will that work?
What if someone who does not want to do a public release we should respect that too no ? And never update the game .
What if a game got leaked on a different platform ? Will mods here wait for the PUBLIC release.
What about devs that are not present here or don't own their thread, we still wait for public release or just update the game as soon as it get leakes ? That won't hurt thier finance

I don't mind if it's was the case for every single game which is obviously not .mods playing favourites is what I am concerned about.

 

[Tiur]

Ohh so it's a rule that you don't share any version which is not publicly available. So no leaked version get posted here of any game?
Or is this respect is selective I wonder

Every thread should only feature public release then. And I wonder what rule that guy who posted the link violated ?
I have seen people positing links on the site before it didn't got deleted.

So if you are not a RESPECTED dev in the forum it's fine if the game got released before the public release.
As I said have no problem waiting for public release but what about the time frame, if a dev decide 6 months or a year how will that work?
What if someone who does not want to do a public release we should respect that too no ? And never update the game .
What if a game got leaked on a different platform ? Will mods here wait for the PUBLIC release.
What about devs that are not present here or don't own their thread, we still wait for public release or just update the game as soon as it get leakes ? That won't hurt thier finance

I don't mind if it's was the case for every single game which is obviously not .mods playing favourites is what I am concerned about.

My post above already answers every question you asked here.

It's about participation and reasonability, not anyone "playing favourites". Also, I would highly recommend when posting in an active discussion, it may be beneficial to read at least the latest page to see if your questions have already been answered or not.)

"... if a dev decide 6 months or a year...?" - 4th bullet point. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days).
"What if someone... does not want to do public release...?" - 4th bullet point. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days).
"What if a game got leaked on a different platform?" - 1st bullet point. Leaks elsewhere mean we can link here. That's already a rule on the site.
"What about devs that are not present here or don't own their thread?" - 2nd and 4th bullet points. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days) if the dev is present here, or whenever for devs who are not present here (as incentive for them to join this forum).

 

[Mr. Tearson]

The kind of absolutism you're suggesting is a bad idea, because it either drives devs away from a potential feedback/support channel, or it makes the forum useless. Using judgement is important when walking a thin line between engagement and support and public access to the games.

This is what I would consider the ideal method for a piracy forum that also respects devs (and this is really the only one that even comes close):

• Regardless of dev activity, if a game is leaked elsewhere, links should be allowed to be posted here.
  • There's no good reason crippling the site's usability if the cat's already out of the bag somewhere else.
• If the dev is not active in the thread or isn't on the forum, links should be allowed to be posted whenever someone leaks them.
  • This incentivizes devs to come to this forum and engage/communicate.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, and the game has regular public releases, links should be posted when the public version goes public, preferably by the dev themselves.
  • This is important to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time to incentivize supporters. No support incentive = no support = dev burnout/abandonment.
• If the dev is active in the thread or owns the thread, but the game does not have regular public releases, or it has very long periods between supporter release and public release (greater than 30 days), generally speaking people should let a reasonable amount of time pass (15-30 days is the most common range I've seen considered "reasonable") before leaking the update.
  • This is to allow the dev some supporter exclusivity time like the previous entry, but putting that timeline more in line with the rest of the industry.
  • Yes, this means devs who do not want public releases at all are somewhat screwed here, but they really should understand that this is how the industry works.

Ohh so it's a rule that you don't share any version which is not publicly available. So no leaked version get posted here of any game?
Or is this respect is selective I wonder

Every thread should only feature public release then. And I wonder what rule that guy who posted the link violated ?
I have seen people positing links on the site before it didn't got deleted.

So if you are not a RESPECTED dev in the forum it's fine if the game got released before the public release.
As I said have no problem waiting for public release but what about the time frame, if a dev decide 6 months or a year how will that work?
What if someone who does not want to do a public release we should respect that too no ? And never update the game .
What if a game got leaked on a different platform ? Will mods here wait for the PUBLIC release.
What about devs that are not present here or don't own their thread, we still wait for public release or just update the game as soon as it get leakes ? That won't hurt thier finance

I don't mind if it's was the case for every single game which is obviously not .mods playing favourites is what I am concerned about.

My post above already answers every question you asked here.

It's about participation and reasonability, not anyone "playing favourites". Also, I would highly recommend when posting in an active discussion, it may be beneficial to read at least the latest page to see if your questions have already been answered or not.)

"... if a dev decide 6 months or a year...?" - 4th bullet point. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days).
"What if someone... does not want to do public release...?" - 4th bullet point. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days).
"What if a game got leaked on a different platform?" - 1st bullet point. Leaks elsewhere mean we can link here. That's already a rule on the site.
"What about devs that are not present here or don't own their thread?" - 2nd and 4th bullet points. My recommendation is to post links after a reasonable amount of time (15-30 days) if the dev is present here, or whenever for devs who are not present here (as incentive for them to join this forum).

@King Tiur pretty much explained it all. Has nothing to do with playing favorites. It's about finding a healthy boundary between Devs and Users on this site. If the game is released elsewhere, we'd add it on here. But knowing Ketzal since he's been extremely active, we tend to trust him as his word is good.

Like I said. A little trust can go a long way. We do need to stop this conversation as we're going too far off-topic. You can create a General Discussion Off-Topic thread for this one. Me and quite a few others will answer.

 

[SeveredRealms]

Ok one lets get back on topic of the game itself... I will however add.... Ketzel has asked to be the one to release it and I will make sure it stays that way. This is not selective this is by request. Also the links that showed up here the other day came straight from Ketzels support links and the game has not been released on any other site at that time. Yes I checked the links to see where they came from..... Now that I have said what needed to be said. Drop the subject please.

 

[superpuma]

KETZAL... Your work is SHOW, I really like the quality, the beauty of the characters but I don't give much importance to the plot, as we all know it's nothing more than fiction. I regret not being able to pay at this moment, as I would follow it daily if I could, but I will do so as soon as possible. Follow the game and thanks for sharing.

 

[ady13]

how bout other content beside the game, will they be released here? comics/renders etc

 

[User_12]

how bout other content beside the game, will they be released here? comics/renders etc

No sorry. That is only for my subs.

 

[BadJM]

how bout other content beside the game, will they be released here? comics/renders etc

You're getting Leana in game, if you ask me that is more than enough for us plebs.

 

[User_48642]

If they never shared it, no one except the dev would know of its existence. Can't really feel like you're missing out in that case, can you

But of course you probably mean content that's only shared with subscribers / patrons. Devs are free to give incentives for subscribing, and we shouldn't be out to hunt down every little piece of exclusive content just for the sake of it or for fear of missing out. Remember, none of us are entitled to anything.
If you don't like what the dev is doing for their subscribers, then... Your life doesn't really change, and you can happily carry on with what you did get and can get elsewhere on this site and the others like it. For free and with absolutely no effort on your part.

We, as in most people here on LC, respect the devs and their efforts in creating the games that brings us all together. I hope you can do the same.
Now, please drop the subject.

 

[superpuma]

Leana, Tiffany, Hailey, Luna, Lisa...

 

[ady13]

If they never shared it, no one except the dev would know of its existence. Can't really feel like you're missing out in that case, can you

But of course you probably mean content that's only shared with subscribers / patrons. Devs are free to give incentives for subscribing, and we shouldn't be out to hunt down every little piece of exclusive content just for the sake of it or for fear of missing out. Remember, none of us are entitled to anything.
If you don't like what the dev is doing for their subscribers, then... Your life doesn't really change, and you can happily carry on with what you did get and can get elsewhere on this site and the others like it. For free and with absolutely no effort on your part.

We, as in most people here on LC, respect the devs and their efforts in creating the games that brings us all together. I hope you can do the same.
Now, please drop the subject.

ok to avoid more offtopic here i made a new Thread here: https://lewdcorner.com/threads/about-site-identity-and-rules-about-sharing-content.5144/

 

[JAW1986baby]

I mean for me personally, when a dev wants to share with everyone but only after an exclusive period for the subs
That is great. You can get a VN by patiently waiting and some people get it faster and support the dev

WIN - WIN

I only advocate for remembering this is a Pirate site when a game will never be shared. DPC is a great example. That ass hat makes BANK $$$ but still acts like anyone ever getting his game for free is the worst cruel tragedy that can befall him.

As a supporter of some devs it is often the case that I cannot support EVERYONE who I like. Also the reality is there are a lot of people who maybe cannot afford to support anyone. Are we so cruel as to feel like they should flat out just never get the entertainment?? EVER??

So that is why you should do what you can for support - any appreciation you can. And respect those devs that get it, and will share with everyone after a reasonable time.

So the balance they try to walk here of respect versus Piracy is well done for the most part, I think. And my hat is off to Ketzal for being one of the devs who gets it.

PEACE (and Fk DPC )

 

[User_12]

@ketzal great game ?
Just one question is pregnancy planned for all the dau*hters and will it be optional ?
I haven't played quite a few updates.

Depending on your choices, at the end of V0.8 some of them may be pregnant. There's a hidden variable to handle this. Visible pregnancy will be from V11 or 12 onwards. And in V0.10 there will be pregnancy in the flashbacks. In fact, in v0.8, there are two scenes with MACY pregnant.

 

[superpuma]

If there is a possibility, if there is this path, none of the lolis will get pregnant, only love and pleasure... that will be my version. LOL.