discussion Abandoned VN Ren'Py [HS2] Money or Morals [Day4.5] [Ronovan]

[pregame]

extremely disapointing. This had such great potential. It would be nice to his suporters and fans if at least he could finish the camping trip. my message is to at least suck it up and finish the camping trip.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

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And another one bites the dust. Has no one heard of the 7 P's? Proper preparation and planning prevents piss poor performance. Maybe at least write the entire story first so corners and wasted renders are avoided instead of just winging it to the next update? And people wonder why I seldom give money to half-finished shit anymore. Oh well, like other devs that abandonded their projects I probably won't care about whatever comes after, it will prob just get abandoned too. I miss the days when people released only finished shit or nothing at all before crowdfunding was a thing, as that seems like more of a curse than a blessing.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

extremely disapointing. This had such great potential. It would be nice to his suporters and fans if at least he could finish the camping trip. my message is to at least suck it up and finish the camping trip.

Shit planning, plain and simple. He wrote the story toward that before realizing there's no assets in HS that will make it look like a camping trip, and after realizing that he basically just gave up and said "fuck it all". Sheer genius. I had a feeling this was going to happen a few progress reports ago around New Year's on SS when it had nothing to do with MoM, but what he was watching on Netflix or some shit.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

Well another bites the dust. Lesson here is don't take money and make games for grey area kinks.

Very disappointed with this announcement as the game was finally starting to get good.

Or at all. I'm not paying shit to any AVN dev that just makes vanilla crap I can find the real versions of for free. The kinks had nothing to do with it in this case, just frustration arising from lack of planning it seems, along with a new lack of interest (personally I'd do it anyway if people are paying me to do it, but that's just me, sometimes you work a job you hate but do it anyway).

 

[sharkz]

Gotta be honest, happend once and clinged onto Skyrim garbage for a few and didn't seem to interest him either, don't get be wrong - was happy when he announced Update 4.5 of MoM but now i'm not surprised that he drops the Game all together.
At least he wrote he's not doing it for the Money ( if it's believeable nowadays ) which he then again is in the minority unfortunately. Still interested what he's coming up with even if when's just short-games.

 

[gestved]

Worst part is that next update was going to be a camp with the brother's girlfriend and she is my main interest in the whole story. Hope we have a short story about it.

But yeah, I feel that games with secret agent plotlines always go bad. We just want to fuck the sister dude, no one cares about your conspiracy.

 

[yoyomistro]

Thank you

Also, guys. The money I make from this hobby is not the deciding factor on whether I continue or stop development of something. I do it because I enjoy it, the money is a nice addition.

Damn. Can't say I'm not disappointed, but hopefully the next thing down the pike is actually more degenerate than this lol. I was hopefully it would be some super degen stuff with a ton of non-con and manipulation, but it kept getting more vanilla release after release. Not saying I didn't like it, but us degen-enjoyers are fiending for scraps these days. Great work on what you put out though, and looking forward to what comes in the future.

 

[Nicest_Incest]

Gotta be honest, happend once and clinged onto Skyrim garbage for a few and didn't seem to interest him either, don't get be wrong - was happy when he announced Update 4.5 of MoM but now i'm not surprised that he drops the Game all together.
At least he wrote he's not doing it for the Money ( if it's believeable nowadays ) which he then again is in the minority unfortunately. Still interested what he's coming up with even if when's just short-games.

Most AVNs make peanuts these days, Like $2/hr, maybe close to min wage if one is lucky and sticks with it a few years. Anyone that makes an AVN for money is usually a fool with ridiculous expectations that will most likely be unrealized. Need money = get a job as an Uber driver or something, that easily makes more than an AVN probably ever will and in far fewer hours spent on it. I forget which dev it was but they posted their earnings on SS for the previous year = a whole $3k or so, and they treat it as a 2nd full time job = 2k hours spend for that $3k = $1.50/hr. I guess that would explain the current influx of foreign devs that barely speak Engrish, I guess if one is stuck in a shithole country $1.50 might be what they'd normally make a day rather than per hour.

I first saw the February post and thought the abandoned tag was incorrect, then saw the next post...
It's sad seeing the abandoned again, but at the same time, I can't really blame Ronovan for abandoning it. These types of games (loli) are a work of passion that likely will never pay financially. If he doesn't feel any passion for continuing it, there's really no point since if he did, all we would get would be a subpar, passionless project.
Ronovan, if you read this hope you continue making what you love and find a program that can bring your vision to reality.

Loli is actually the best paying genre if you can find a way to monetize it (where there's a will there's a way) due to lack of competition if it doesn't suck. Ketzal and Blackheart do ok ($100k a year or so as a guess). Proud Father made over $30k a month, it was just made in the wrong country. Otherwise it is a crapshoot with the dice stacked against you, because you then have to try to get noticed among 5000 other AVNs that people more than likely won't give a shit about enough to give money to due to over-abundance and free availability pretty much everywhere. Porn in general has the same problem, unless you focus on rare kinks (incest, scat, bestiality, C P on the darkweb, whatever) people generally are not going to pay for it when they can get it for free with minimal effort on some tube or torrent site or with a creative Google search. The way I see it my AVN support money (what little of it there still is) only goes to loli devs (preferably Renpy/Daz) since they are the ones that need it most and because mainstream shit there's too much of already and I couldn't care less if all that's abandoned or not (over 1800 vanilla AVNs I haven't got to play yet in my collection and prob never will due to lack of time, even if another vanilla AVN was never made ever again).

Games like this are too taboo to make money. They are a target for Patreon and you can't put them on Steam. You make some through Subscribestar, but I imagine it's not much. Add in if you're not doing it because you actually like doing it, and it's really hard to make much.

Lol the taboo is what actually makes the money once popularity spreads. High risk = high reward. Prob only 1% of vanilla AVN devs still make more than min wage, Patreon or no Patreon, with or without Steam (which usually isn't as lucrative as people seem to think, porn on Steam is blocked altogether in most of the world, aside from them taking a 30% cut, if one is going the Steam route prob better luck just making a non-porn regular game). Loli AVNs are probably a new AVN dev's best bet, if you can find a way around the bullshit policies. Most are now simply on Unifans which seems to have had more foresight than SS and simply made it to where you can either use crypto or you use your cc to buy intermediate coins rather than subbing to devs directly, and if they were smart they have also set up some shell companies at the same time laundering their money for them the way Backpage did (to where Visa/MC had no idea and no way to know what the transactions were actually for or what site the money was actually going to, even after they banned their original merchant accounts). The few more established Daz/Loli/Renpy devs left off the top of my head do ok and so did a few abandoned ones, which weren't abandoned for financial reasons but because the devs lived in the wrong country (Proud Father was making $30k a month by it's 3rd year, at least until Westy got too comfortable and ended up arrested instead of leaving that shithole country which he could have easily afforded to do long before that point).

 

[Uzi]

Thank you

Also, guys. The money I make from this hobby is not the deciding factor on whether I continue or stop development of something. I do it because I enjoy it, the money is a nice addition.

Super sad to hear this is over, but understandable.
Good luck on your future projects.

 

[kpoptarts]

Worst part is that next update was going to be a camp with the brother's girlfriend and she is my main interest in the whole story. Hope we have a short story about it.

But yeah, I feel that games with secret agent plotlines always go bad. We just want to fuck the sister dude, no one cares about your conspiracy.

Going to cuck your brother? Too bad, the dev cucked us instead

 

[AlBetGam]

Most AVNs make peanuts these days, Like $2/hr, maybe close to min wage if one is lucky and sticks with it a few years. Anyone that makes an AVN for money is usually a fool with ridiculous expectations that will most likely be unrealized. Need money = get a job as an Uber driver or something, that easily makes more than an AVN probably ever will and in far fewer hours spent on it. I forget which dev it was but they posted their earnings on SS for the previous year = a whole $3k or so, and they treat it as a 2nd full time job = 2k hours spend for that $3k = $1.50/hr. I guess that would explain the current influx of foreign devs that barely speak Engrish, I guess if one is stuck in a shithole country $1.50 might be what they'd normally make a day rather than per hour.

It's like OnlyFans or Uber or Amway or a bunch of other "you can be your own boss and set your own hours and make a crapload of money" gigs. People look at it and base their calculations on the top-earning 1% ("wow Radiant makes how much a month!?") without realizing that those are the extreme outliers and when they get into it they will most likely filter into the bottom 90% and make next to nothing.

 

[Djin]

Oh cool, another disappointment. There really is no point in being excited anymore is there?

 

[Nicest_Incest]

Oh cool, another disappointment. There really is no point in being excited anymore is there?

mostly not, unless it's a new loli AVN from the veteran devs like Blackheart or Ketzal.

 

[Duke Leo]

Worst part is that next update was going to be a camp with the brother's girlfriend and she is my main interest in the whole story. Hope we have a short story about it.

But yeah, I feel that games with secret agent plotlines always go bad. We just want to fuck the sister dude, no one cares about your conspiracy.

I figured this was what was going to happen as soon as the "round up" night occurred. The game was just getting too big and went off the rails.

Maybe Dev will consider a re-write and come back to this universe. Keep the characters and most of the story but cut out the vast conspiracy. That would still leave being a teacher, a photographer, and the drug/criminal aspect. There is a ton to work with!

 

[User_23742]

I figured this was what was going to happen as soon as the "round up" night occurred. The game was just getting too big and went off the rails.

Maybe Dev will consider a re-write and come back to this universe. Keep the characters and most of the story but cut out the vast conspiracy. That would still leave being a teacher, a photographer, and the drug/criminal aspect. There is a ton to work with!

You're exactly right. Which is why I will make more content with the characters from the game in shorter "spin-off" format games.

Money or Morals is NOT dead. The "main" game is.

 

[sharkz]

Money or Morals is NOT dead. The "main" game is.

No offense but in this Context it is dead, doesn't matter if you use Characters of the Game for "spin-offs", at least that's how i see it but anyhow - i'm still curious what you come up with.

 

[JoeTheMc84]

You're exactly right. Which is why I will make more content with the characters from the game in shorter "spin-off" format games.

Money or Morals is NOT dead. The "main" game is.

I posted this on the other site, but will make a comment here too, not sure which you're more active on:

"I hope I'm wrong but, to me, making spin offs sounds a lot like something that is going to be used to make other stories or "not canon" events to excuse... well, I'll just say questionable content... You'll want to use all the cute models you've made, I'd bet money on that, but will you have it just be the Mc from MoM doing the fucking of those models? Again, I might be wrong and I hope I am, but experience tells me that "spin offs," is often code for "not technically," three letter content. And often, "I'm bored or not inspired anymore by this," often means, "I want to make things that won't fly with my fans like having the lol1's in gangbangs, sharing and swinging, and stuff, but it would cost me to make it in this game I said wouldn't have that kind of stuff." Once again, I hope I'm wrong, but also, experience tells me this is often how it goes.

If I am wrong and the spin offs are not just round-about ways to get characters from this into situations where other characters bang them or they are in things that wouldn't fly in this game then I'll be very happy, as I liked this a lot and wouldn't mind some side content if it was this Mc still with these girls. Anyway, I'll avoid a long rant this time, cheers."

 

[manporn37]

Definitely understandable but super unfortunate to hear

 

[Faye]

You're exactly right. Which is why I will make more content with the characters from the game in shorter "spin-off" format games.

Money or Morals is NOT dead. The "main" game is.

I do think short story games can work, and give writers/devs an outlet for ideas without the pressure to release constant updates.


I'm looking forward to whatever you release, you have a talent

 

[Nicest_Incest]

No offense but in this Context it is dead, doesn't matter if you use Characters of the Game for "spin-offs", at least that's how i see it but anyhow - i'm still curious what you come up with.

Yeah that would be like Ketzal saying Such a Sharp Pain isn't dead if he abandoned it and just made new 3- or 4-part AVNs from the LI side paths (Alice, Macy, Leanna). Not at all the same. Most devs simply rewrite/rework it rather than abandoned it and reuse the models from the scraps. Hell just being a ped0 photographer and the club plot would be plenty to work with, not even counting the individual LI stories (ie MC getting Lily's older sister and maybe even also a couple of her friends pregnant would make some nice drama, as would a bunch of close calls of nearly getting caught since Lily can't keep a secret and told half her school about her teacher's "motivation methods").